I would like to see some examples of changing the world in non violent ways, as well, because where I sit from, with the power of the internet at my command, I fail to see any examples of lasting change brought about by non violence that wasnt backed by a stick or the promise of one. Even Ghandi, the poster child for that movement, stated that non violence is more about getting violented on to make the other guy look bad than about your point. Justice and being right have always taken second base in the world to firepower, which as a self professed soldier you should understand.

I find it risible that you, a soldier, in, I assume, the US of A Military would say something like this: “instead of trying to change the world in non-violent ways opt for force instead. They seek to enforce their will on the rest of the world who never asked them to kill for the sake of peace. They want to change the world because they think that they know better, and this, to me, is arrogant and unappealing.” while basically doing, well, exactly that. I guess hypocresy is in no short supply, and a “It’s not the same at all, we decided to bring them peace and democracy and by God they will like it if we have to kill every single one of them” variation will follow, but I digress.

It is not the stated purpose of CB to “solve all of the worlds problems” and from what I see, they do not intend to, but rather to equate God as an enforcer of Morality. And just like God, they don’t necessarily have to be particularly moral in going about it, after all, they determine morality. I would take this to be the basis of the Celestial Being name and all the religious codenames.

As for the rest, you seem to want too many answers straight off the bat, from the show it’s possible to garner that they have mining stations (I’ll assume that the “solar reactors” are H3 fission reactors like the UC Gundam ones that require a mining facility in Jupiter). And it would be hard to say that they arent under Schenbergs thumb.

Finally I would answer to your conclusion that, as far as Gundam shows go, this one doesn’t have a particularly huge disparity between the Gundam side and the non gundam side, I find it hard to believe that you would say there is a huge disparity in this, where the UN comes up with units that are about equal to the Gundams at the drop of a hat upon getting the reactors, while praising the UC Gundams that tended to be impervious to everything, and unmatched by anything sans the commander unit at the end of the show (Sans maybe Camilles non Gundamium one at the start of Z).

Ill agree with Sumeragi’s incompetence though.

In the end, you are free to like or dislike whatever you want, but I think you put too much of your own wants and expectations against what the show actually is, and delivers. I find that a lot of it has been well reasoned, and the developments are mostly credible. It is hardly perfect, but it is pretty good.

And Im relieved that people tend to die sort of often. you are a soldier, you should know, people die. Interesting pilots die too. A nice UC throwback.

Hideo Kojima hired a military consultant, hell, even Tsukasa Hojo was required to get some shooting lesson in the police station to get a grasp on firearm physics before drawing City Hunter.

Even if scriptwriters may not be able to afford that, there are still plenty of war movies like “Platoon” (Oliver Stone actually served in Vietnam) and “Das Boot” or series like “Tour of Duty” or “Band of Brothers” to give them a grasp of what human drama in war situation would be like.

But I guess this is too much to ask to japanese anime staffs.

That, and Celestial Being hardly succeeded in the most straightforward way at all. All their tactics was basically riding on the retaliatory tactics of the more powerful world nations and from the look of the end of things, it has worked to a degree with the new Earth Federation formation.

Also, the thing with Gundam 00 is that it strikes me as a bit prequel-ish. Most Gundam shows start off with very well defined groups. Rebels/Empire or Spacies/Earthlings. In Gundam 00, all that was basically formative and overall, I think you have to look past the specificities of real life politics to see where the politics regarding mobile suits at least is concerned.

I can understand the criticism actually, because many Gundam shows do take it slower (even the rocket-propelled speed of developments in Gundam Wing was more methodical than 00’s), but I think it depends on the willingness of viewers to set that aside and at least assume what is going on here.

Because in the end, we still know very little of what truly went behind the scenes and why Celestial Being still wants to change the world even after the events in episode 25.

@Shippoyasha
Different people watch different series expecting different things. The political backdrop could have been interesting but that fell apart. The Mecha fights remain cool, but there are times when the context is just lost, like Graham’s last charge. If my memory serves me correctly Zeta Gundam had some pretty heavy stuff and there the mecha fights were woven neatly with the Titan/AEUG/Axis Zeon scheming.

Metal Gear Solid was built of Kojima’s vision, Gundam does have a legacy of being able to neatly weave politics and mecha together. As it stands I still can’t understand the whole story of Metal Gear…I doubt there is anyone other than Kojima who knows the whole story.

@Deckard
I do not think that they really have given credit to Corner for giving them the GN-Xs Lagna Harvey came from almost nowhere and even Corner seemed a bit surprised when the Trinities first came on. I still think Lagna was playing his own games and the Corner was able to take advantage of Lagna.

Contrary to most guys proclaiming to join the military for nationalism, there are plenty who joined for the chance to go to college, or simply because they couldn’t find work elsewhere. I have met guys who joined during peacetime who refused to go places outright. If pushed hard enough even the most veteran soldier would consider deserting. It’s not the kind of blind idealism or belief in one’s country. It’s not 100% selflessness. Even within the US military there are groans of how the republic was not what it once was or how we imagined it. We serve because at some level we care, but how much we care varies from guy to the next. We do not all believe that what we are being asked to do now is 100% right, but we follow because we hope that the situation will get better. Tieria and Setsuna fight at times just to show that they are relevant, most soldiers would be against fighting and dying merely to prove a point. Fighting merely to prove a point is fanatcism, and professionals are as a rule not fanatics.

My expectations for the second half have been significantly lowered, all I want now is to see the Ali kill streak continue and to see where the UN blokes go. If Ribbons proves himself the greatest villain in all of Gundam I will be pleasantly surprised, but as it stand I just want him to be better than Corner.

@Setsuna-san
Thanks, should have thrown out my initial expectations early on instead of holding out hope in vain.

@Myssa
Ah a loyalist infiltration army, well those are certainly rare. I just remember how hard it was fighting Alpha Legion with static Tau. Seems that Black Legion is getting really pimped out these days, well its all good. At least the Defiler is not longer used as an artillery piece…indirect fire was a pain.

@rollchan
Yes he is dead and I hope he stays that way there can only be one masked character and it is Graham.

@frog212
I started out with Wing and then went back to the older stuff, nevertheless if you decide to go back one of these days you might see some faults here and there but it will be your first mecha love.

Corner’s ego is like Le Creuset, don’t you think? But the latter is rather more psychotic. LOL!

I hope, you’ll consider to blog Season 2 starting in October, Crusader.

Thank you for blogging Gundam 00 Season 1.

Back to the topic. Temper-temper, and let’s at least keep this discussion within the realms of semi-civilized debate. All parties spoke their piece, gave sound argument and counter-arguments, but let’s not let our passions run away too much.

As always, let’s see the Crusader’s final thoughts on the penultimate episode of Gundam 00 (Jason, DarkMirage, and Kaioh seem to have theirs up already).

and Crusader, i find your style of writing to be most entertaining. dont ever deviate from it no matter what others say.

The Emperor protects.

Though I wouldn’t argue with you on the matters of Miss Sumeragi and related combat matters; I do have to point out that unlike every modern army where no individual solider yields significant power, Gundams are dramatically different since every single one of them is an army in its own right. Thus unlike regular soldiers, Gundam pilots not only want to fulfil their desires, but they also have capacity to do so.

What I do disagree with, is the political and financial aspect of your criticism. True, political dimension is underdeveloped to say the least, but it’s not as ludicrous as you make it appear. To start off, your view of politics as zero-sum game is already a problem. There is equally valid view that politics is in fact a positive sum game which is what I believe the creators of the series are trying to drive home. If I understood the plot correctly, CB is not trying to eliminate every single small conflict by directly intervening – though they do plenty of that to – rather they are trying to present the Three with a threat and in that way to unite them. The writers may have borrowed the idea from the WWII and I wonder if the end result would be the same (i.e. continuation of Cold War after CB is defeated.)

As for how Corner got the support – or dominance – of the UN, well, given he was the one who showered the Three with GN-X’s, provided intelligence, and (probably) financial assets it’s no wonder he had influence in the UN, though I doubt that his influence is actually that great. (We still don’t know the full extent of his political power.)

The financial side of CB operations – though the least explored in the series – is actually the most convincing. Unlike you’ve mentioned, I believe that the members of the CB would not suffer from the CB’s activities. Quite the contrary, they would prosper because for one they new in advance about a major political-military-economic event which gives them plentiful opportunity to profit from markets (including stock markets). That is of course if they where not rich to begin with. But it seems that CB members had plenty of fund (and physical assets) to begin with. Unfortunately, as you said, the series have not explained the precise origin of the members’ wealth, so it’s probably premature to criticise the CB for hypocrisy on financial grounds.

Lastly, I don’t find the ideology of CB all that offensive or objectionable. Although you may not think so, the members of the Three also fight for ideology. Most importantly idea they seem to have is that they must protect or serve their country which is a notion of nationalism - an ideology. Since I don’t see the soldiers of the Three saying “Go to hell, you can take my pay check, but I’m not going to fight Gundams since I know I’ll end up in a coffin”; I doubt they are in the army for the money. They also don’t seem to enjoy the fighting like Ali does. Then Nationalism remains the most plausible explanation behind the motivation of the soldiers of the Three. (Revenge is viable for a rather small proportion of the UN army; also the original CB didn’t attack civilian targets so the idea of protecting one’s family is farfetched). CB also fights for ideology, only a different one. They are perhaps more deserving of the praise because unlike to UN army, the CB actually questions their ideology, their motivation, etc.

There, it’s all done. I do know that much of the above ideas are underdeveloped and have powerful counterarguments, but please try not to dismiss it outright like I don’t dismiss your writing.

Cheers

Also, I tend to believe (apparently correctly so from all the criticism aimed at the show), that those who criticize are the ones who delve into it the most. Gundam shows, hell, mecha in general are not meant for heavyhanded, realistic military politics. I mean, how would Metal Gear Solid have turned out if it was truly realistic, eh? Something beyond boring?

The very simplified explanation is that they wanted something, couldn’t have it, and therefore deemed it to be unworthy of their efforts by mocking it despite it’s other merits.

It’s one of Aesop’s fairy tales about morality by the way, “The Fox And The Grapes”.

I lol’d.

Please continue to provide the community with such amusing entertainment.

Anyway, sorry about that, Crusader. About Graham’s mask, it looks to me like the kind of mask that burns patient wear.